Total Bs! (tuf)

[disgruntled]

Tommy should not have won. he went in swinging his arms, yeah he can take down, but surprise surprise he is strong. is MMA a MA or not? in what other MA would we rule that some one that is strong but has no skill should win a match?? (it was desicion, he did not knock anyone out, so the decision is completely contingent on what the judges consider "good" fighting) i started off with no respect for MMA, but decided that i had better watch it if i want to really say anything with conviction.... and yeah i did gain a lot of respect for MMA and the training that they do, but the more i have been watching, it is hard not to see how many people are in it that are not MAist. the fighters that deserve respect are so few and many in between that it is really sad. and with the exception of Tito, most of them are fairly reserved and thus do not get the air time that the others do because Dana White is a publicity whore.

[tntma12]

I agree with you to a point. MMA is getting too commercialized, but there are some great fighters, not all great martial artists, but good fighters, and it seems alot like that is all that matters now. I dont think it has as much to do with MA as it does fighting, and many people dont think there is a difference. I certainly agree about Dana being a publicity whore though.

[disgruntled]

but it is called Mixed Martial Arts. it is kinda like how Molsen still calls their beer "Canadian". it is just wrong

but seriously. it is called a Martial Art, so what does that mean for the future of it and MAs ingeneral. i am all aboard with calling it a martial sport, and then would not be as upset with the bastardization. but i do not think that is doing it justice because as you said there are a lot of good fighters, and some that are extrodinary MAist. what we need is another organization that can represent the fighters and the sport better.

...... honestly (to hit on your last point) there is no difference from fighting and martial arts. in the end all we are doing is attacking and defending. the beauty of the sport is the more "bushido" aspects of it, but i think they only exist because decent people need a code of honour to deal with the concept of hurting people. so that is likely to exist in any formalized fighting school. the difference is that Tommy won his fight by decision. the judges looked at both guys fighting, one technical and one raw and CHOSE the winner, the unskilled one. if Tommy knocked the other guy out then yeah he won, but he did not. so it makes you wonder how they choose their winners. "i like the guy that hits thing"?

i once read an article from a guy that judged muay thai matches, and yes biases like that do exist, but the rules seem to be fairly formalized so that strength in technique is the tie breaker when no one wins.

Tommy was able to throw Ben down, but once down just stayed in Ben's gaurd and occationally threw punches and elbows. Ben attempted many submissions did some good defence. Tommy is a big guy and can take a lot of damage, so Ben's submissions did not work, but either did Tommy's hits. Ben was not knocked out and was not close at any time. and Tommy 'won' both rounds. i might give him the second with mild convincing, but not the first. he was almost submitted twice in the first 2 mins. and did not get in any really good hits.

[tntma12]

I fully agree with you, except for one point. You mentioned there is no difference between fighting and martial arts, I disagree. There are plenty of excellent martial artists that may not be great fighters and great fighters that may technically be poor martial artists. Of course this is only my opinion on this matter.

I also do not feel that MMA or the UFC is "the ultimate testing grounds" for martial arts, as there is too many variables that come into play. Esspecially since there are only a few MA's that are even represented in MMA, and most intelligent martial artists know that these are not the only effective arts

[tntma12]

Just another point I wanted to mention. There has been much talk about changing the way MMA is judged, which I think could help things alot. I hope that it does change, it would be interesting to see how it changes the MMA world.

[disgruntled]

Originally Posted by tntma12

I fully agree with you, except for one point. You mentioned there is no difference between fighting and martial arts, I disagree. There are plenty of excellent martial artists that may not be great fighters and great fighters that may technically be poor martial artists. Of course this is only my opinion on this matter.

I also do not feel that MMA or the UFC is "the ultimate testing grounds" for martial arts, as there is too many variables that come into play. Esspecially since there are only a few MA's that are even represented in MMA, and most intelligent martial artists know that these are not the only effective arts

i see your point for the first part and i agree. good point. i was kinda thinking of more the development of MAs and why they exist...

i completely agree with the second point. i have never saw UFC as a good way to compare the arts, especially because you are not comparing the arts you are comparing fighters. not to mention with all the rules many MAs are rendered useless.

it will be interesting to see if the judging is changed and how that will effect things.